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 Post subject: Re: New YouTube Video
 Post Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 6:28 pm 
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Location: Jackson, Mississippi
Ain'tGotNoPokemon wrote:
isn't worth arguing about. ;)


Then why are you?


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 Post subject: Re: New YouTube Video
 Post Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 6:45 pm 
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Location: Australia
Rickenbrother wrote:
8MilesHigher wrote:
Great video there JH ! And thanks for sharing the Ed Sullivan show story.

+1!


Yes agreement is in order here! I have now realised it is not going to be easy to find anyone who had an interest or association with Ric's and had a TV and watched the Beatles first appearance on the Ed Sullivan show in '64. Most guitarist didn't become aware of Rickenbacker guitars till later. It was the exposure of the Beatles and interest the Media gave them that put Rickenbacker fair and square on the music map. If Mr Hall had seen the show his perspective would have been like no others, he had that connection, he was at the age when it would have had an impact! Mr Hall has told us his whereabouts :lol: the Nights the Beatles played, he was attending school and no TV in the home at that stage.

We definitely did not have a TV in Australia in 1964 in our home, and yes school was more important, TV that came much later. Even if we did have a TV......no way would my parents encourage me to watch even if I was older :lol: ! It's going to be near impossible to get an account from someone who has some association with Ric's had the TV and watched, I suppose have a memory that survived the 60s and those parent let them watch should be included :lol:!

The odds of finding a person who was this lucky way back in 1964 and can still give an account are now very slim.


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 Post subject: Re: New YouTube Video
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 03, 2011 2:57 am 
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Location: Northern California
Wow--covering a lot of ground in this thread! First off, the vid is very cool. I wish it was longer, but it's still cool. Regarding pronunciation--it can be a strange thing. I used to live in Wichita, KS, and I immediately branded myself as an outsider by pronouncing the name of a nearby town "El Dor-AH-do" rather than "El Dor-AY-do" (it's spelled "El Dorado") like the natives do. I live in Vallejo, CA, and everybody here pronounces it "Vall-AY-ho"--the original Spanish pronunciation was "Va-YAY-ho", and I've heard folks from out-of-state call it "Val-ee-JO"! You say "to-MAY-to", and I say "to-MAH-to"--(let's call the whole thing off...) Accents--I used to play with a Scottish country singer named Tom Lee, who spoke with a pretty thick Scottish brogue, but when he sang, it was pure Nashville. And speaking of country, (howzat for a segue?)--country covers everything from the Carter Family in the 1940's to the latest imitation '80's pop coming out of Nashville these days. Just like rock covers everything from Chuck Berry to Avenged Sevenfold, and blues covers everything from Charley Patton to Joe Bonamassa...


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 Post subject: Re: New YouTube Video
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 03, 2011 7:56 am 
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jfine wrote:
And speaking of country, (howzat for a segue?)--country covers everything from the Carter Family in the 1940's to the latest imitation '80's pop coming out of Nashville these days. Just like rock covers everything from Chuck Berry to Avenged Sevenfold, and blues covers everything from Charley Patton to Joe Bonamassa...

I wouldn't consider the Carter Family Country, but rather Bluegrass. But according to your definition, with the "80's pop," you're including Garth Brooks, Taylor Swift, and many other (as you put it) "imitation" acts. If they are "imitations" then they are not real Country, are they? ;)

I think many A7X fans would disagree that they are Rock, but rather Metal (Or in some instances "alternative"). Genres are fickle labels that cannot be easily defined, either through generations or what's popular.


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 Post subject: Re: New YouTube Video
 Post Posted: Sun Dec 04, 2011 3:53 pm 
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jfine wrote:
Wow--covering a lot of ground in this thread!
And speaking of country, (howzat for a segue?)--country covers everything from the Carter Family in the 1940's to the latest imitation '80's pop coming out of Nashville these days. Just like rock covers everything from Chuck Berry to Avenged Sevenfold, and blues covers everything from Charley Patton to Joe Bonamassa...


Yeah, totally agree. If anything, I'd probably be way more inclined to argue that all this new stuff isn't "country." It took me years before I ever appreciated country music - I used to think there was not one redeemable quality about it. That was pretty naive and close-minded of me, but it gave me a whole new world to discover later when I finally did discover good country (my doorway to it was indeed bluegrass and other Americana / folk), like the Carter Family, Patsy Cline, Willie Nelson, and other greats like Conway Twitty, Loretta Lynn, Tammy Wynette, Ernest Tubb / Texas Troubadours, George Jones, Jimmie Rodgers, Hank Sr., Buck Owens, Faron Young, Curtis Porter, etc. In my view, Garth Brooks and Taylor Swift (Jason Aldean, Shania Twain, Lady Antebellum, etc.) are definitely nowhere near as "country" as Patsy, Willie, and those others listed above, and can't hold a candle to them. In my view, the new artists definitely do qualify for pop, or as I sometimes describe it, "glam country."

Another doorway for me to discover "real" country was a lot of the alt-country music of today (Uncle Tupelo led me to Roy Acuff, Tammy Wynette, and Doug Sahm and the Texas Tornados), and the country-rock music of the 60s and 70s like The Flying Burrito Brothers, New Riders of the Purple Sage, early Poco, and of course the Byrds' Sweetheart of the Rodeo album (anything with Gram Parsons on it), which I guess brings us back to Rickenbacker. (Now how's THAT for a segue!) I love that many early Ricks were twanging guitars for country and western artists (proven by a quick flip through the Rick book), something to remember as a talking point next times someone says you can only do "one thing" on a Rick.


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 Post subject: Re: New YouTube Video
 Post Posted: Sun Dec 04, 2011 4:55 pm 
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Location: Australia
It becomes rather impossible to label all singers with a style, some just very talented and some highly trained singers seem to be able to sing in a few styles! like a pro guitarist can play more than one style

LOL' to get rid of drawl, closed vowel, and general poor diction while singing can mean a lot of hard work, or so one might think. !!!!!

But here's is an old singing trick, I'm not sure what you call Potato chips in the USA I think it is french fries. OK pretend you have just placed a very hot'' french fry'' in your mouth, the back of your soft palette (the back and roof of your mouth) will automatically raise. Sing like you have a hot french fry in your gob!

The roof of your mouth will recoil up and back, this will improve diction while singing!
That simple trick will save you , 5 singing lessons and a few elocution lesson as well!

Kieth Urban,,,,,,,,,,he went the other way and trained to sound like a country hick, when I hear him sing that's not his native Queensland accent, he was brought up just down the road from where I now live! OK he has done well for himself, good on him!

We are musician, we make it up as we go along, the entertainment industry is not a religious vocation, it not like you take a vow to serve to truth or chastity :lol: . Singers can sing as they wish. Ever heard the little white girl that sings and sounds like a black singer in her 40's, that's lots of training and hard work, that's how the little girl could pull of such a feat! Good old hard work effort and dedication from a young person.

It's the entertainment industry. it's full of surprises, professional actors, singers, they have the vocal control and understanding to be able to mimic and alter their voice. No way can you label all singers in to a category, impossible! I have seen country records in people homes that also listen to the Bel canto, but some people have very broad taste. It's all possible!

Music amd singing is best listened too, best not debated! Some singer cannot be labeled! I think music is something to listen to, and not debate!


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 Post subject: Re: New YouTube Video
 Post Posted: Sun Dec 04, 2011 5:23 pm 
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Not debate music? I think that's debatable. :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: New YouTube Video
 Post Posted: Sun Dec 04, 2011 5:29 pm 
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Ain'tGotNoPokemon wrote:
Not debate music? I think that's debatable. :lol:



:lol: :lol: :lol: That's is the one thing we will not debate! :lol: :lol: :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: New YouTube Video
 Post Posted: Sun Dec 04, 2011 6:16 pm 
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jbudweiser wrote:
I think music is something to listen to, and not debate!


Hey, why can't it be both? If I can't spend all my time playing music, then the next best thing is to discuss it, preferrably with a group like this one which shares so many interests.

To me, to be country is to be true to country roots, Ernest Tubb, Patsy, Willie, others named above, etc. And to me, Taylor Swift, etc., are not true to those country roots - it more approaches glam-pop music. Thus, in my view, those mentioned in my previous post - if anything - *defined* country, and the new folk betray it. That's why I mentioned the country music hall of fame (though I'm not sure if that organization truly represents the "majority" opinion of music, and it certainly isn't infallible) - I give more credo to those in it than to these new artists who may prove only to be a flash in the pan in the big picture. Time will tell. (And I don't mean to say I need an awards-organization to endow an artist for me to believe that artist is great - there are plenty great ones out there not recognized, and plenty recognized who are not so great - that's another topic.)

But hey, that's just my opinion - feel free to debate it (as long as you play nice).

PS - Speaking of crossing genres, Tubb's lead guy, Leon Rhodes, is an absolute killer guitar player, who - although he was in a country band - clearly had jazz roots. If you're not familiar with his playing, check it out on YT. I think he paved the way for many "hillbilly jazz" guys who play with amazing technical prowess, but not in an untouchable, pretentious way, like Danny Gatton, Jim Campilongo, and maybe even Roy Buchanan. But now I digress.....


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 Post subject: Re: New YouTube Video
 Post Posted: Mon Dec 05, 2011 1:08 am 
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Location: West Coast Canada
jbud- I know it was not intentional, but sometimes, the best lines come up pretty much by accident. I like one line of your discourse enough to ask permission to borrow it..... gonna stick in my sig block, I think....

"We are musician..."

That says it all, doesn't it, mate?

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Cheers,
RicVic
Canada's Wet Coast.

"We are all musician.."


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