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 Post subject: Re: New Guy Here
 Post Posted: Mon Feb 15, 2010 6:28 am 
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Joined: Sat Jan 30, 2010 7:18 am
Posts: 14
Location: City of Angels, near the Pacific
Ummm...didn't Roger McGuinn and the Byrds tune down 1/2 step?


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 Post subject: Re: New Guy Here
 Post Posted: Mon Feb 15, 2010 8:52 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jun 04, 2009 3:15 am
Posts: 659
Location: Florida
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Ummm...didn't Roger McGuinn and the Byrds tune down 1/2 step?


no, don't think so. I can tune my 370-12 to The Byrds records, then check the A string against a Piano A key, and it is at A=440hz. Neither did George Harrison.

Jimi Hendrix did tune to A flat, or E flat, or however you want to call it, half a step down, but no capo or 12 string, unless you count an unknown acoustic 12 string he played in his documentary, it sounded awful and out of tune, or as you put it, "gutless".


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 Post subject: Re: New Guy Here
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 10:11 am 
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Joined: Sat Jan 30, 2010 7:18 am
Posts: 14
Location: City of Angels, near the Pacific


see if you can play along to this in standard tuning:



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZAejkh4rTjs


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 Post subject: Re: New Guy Here
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 4:33 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jun 04, 2009 3:15 am
Posts: 659
Location: Florida
indeed the guitar is tuned down ½ step in this performance, tuned to A flat; no wonder it sounds "dark" and "gutless".

Maybe he lost his finger callouses :-))



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 Post subject: Re: New Guy Here
 Post Posted: Tue Jun 22, 2010 3:04 am 
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Joined: Sat Sep 27, 2008 10:49 pm
Posts: 573
Location: Stanstead, QC
According to the McGuinn DVD, he recommends tuning down half a step.

Keep in mind, however, that his heyday was well before Ric introduced the double truss rod, probably in answer to some folks not finding the thinner Ric necks holding their straightness or tuning too well with 12 strings. Down a half step gave the neck a little less stress during storage or when practising, but yes, they are mostly seen tuned up to concert pitch on recordings or videos.

A capo may be fine for some, but I find that they make an already narrow neck seem even more claustrophobic. And if you are a relatively inexperienced player like me who relies at various points on the fret markers, then you're really shifting mental gears needlessly.

If we fast forward ahead some 30+ years, construction tolerances are much higher and the newer models, including his signature 370, have dual truss rods, which make the necks much stronger, so concert pitch tuning is not a problem on many modern 12-string guitars, including some less-than-premium makes. Keeping consistent tuning also avoids some intonation issues, which can be problematic on a 12.

The admonition to flat-tune the e or other strings may not be relevant if you pay VERY close attention to nut height. Most guitar makers err on the side of setting the bridge and nut a little too high to avoid buzzing, but at the expense of notes going sharp on the first few frets because the strings get stretched a little too far.

All these technical side-issues aside, man can Roger play!!! You learn something every time when you pay attention to the pros. Rather than complaining about the narrow neck, he takes advantage of it to do some chords mandolin style, using fewer fingers, so he's got any extra finger available for finger-work.

This DVD is a must have for any 12 string Ric player.


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 Post subject: Re: New Guy Here
 Post Posted: Tue Jun 22, 2010 3:25 am 
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Joined: Tue Oct 18, 2005 2:00 pm
Posts: 2945
Location: Kansas
Quote:
According to the McGuinn DVD, he recommends tuning down half a step.

Keep in mind, however, that his heyday was well before Ric introduced the double truss rod, probably in answer to some folks not finding the thinner Ric necks holding their straightness or tuning too well with 12 strings.


The dual truss rod system was introduced in the late 1950's years before Rickenbacker manufactured their first 12-string guitar and Roger's "heyday" with The Byrds in the 1960's.


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 Post subject: Re: New Guy Here
 Post Posted: Tue Jun 22, 2010 7:17 am 
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Joined: Sat Sep 27, 2008 10:49 pm
Posts: 573
Location: Stanstead, QC
Quote:
Quote:
The dual truss rod system was introduced in the late 1950's years before Rickenbacker manufactured their first 12-string guitar and Roger's "heyday" with The Byrds in the 1960's.


I should have specified that I was referring to Ric products only. Mea culpa.

Doesn't substract from the fact that Roger is twice the player most of us will ever be, and that things have progressed positively in the last 50+ years.




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 Post subject: Re: New Guy Here
 Post Posted: Tue Jun 22, 2010 8:16 am 
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Joined: Tue Oct 18, 2005 2:00 pm
Posts: 2945
Location: Kansas
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
The dual truss rod system was introduced in the late 1950's years before Rickenbacker manufactured their first 12-string guitar and Roger's "heyday" with The Byrds in the 1960's.


I should have specified that I was referring to Ric products only. Mea culpa.


I was referring to Rickenbackers double truss rod system introduced in the 1950's and when compared to that date, Roger's heyday is "younger than that now." Great to see him still jangling away!


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 Post subject: Re: New Guy Here
 Post Posted: Fri Jun 25, 2010 5:42 am 
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Joined: Thu Apr 12, 2007 1:11 pm
Posts: 145
Location: Marina Del Rey
Quote:
Redundancy is: 34 pages of "What Does The C Stand For?" and still nobody gets it right, except me of course :-))




=) "WHat does the C stand for" that thread will never end. I am convinced the C stands for the shape of the guitar. Take a look at a 350V63 and tell me if you don't see the C.

=)



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 Post subject: New Guy Here
 Post Posted: Tue Aug 16, 2016 4:25 am 
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Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2016 3:55 am
Posts: 21
Location: Germany
Welcome

Why do you live in Purgatory? We all here are living in Hell. Think about the move:D :D

I bow you in. Enjoy

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[url=modafinil.botswanatourismresearch.org]Read more[/url]


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